So NOW I know what the C63 AMG is REALLY capable of...

[Mr. Happy]

Congrats on your mod. I'd love to try a Renntech flash to compare to my K1 flash. I'm sure the difference is more in the feel than in the performance per se. Before making my decision, I made extensive research on others including Renntech. Living in Toronto, I had to send my ECU to the US anyway so going to this stress was required to access the extra power. To readers of this thread: if you have a C63 tuned with Renntech and live in the Toronto area, please let me know. It would be great to compare the differences with my Kleemann K1 tune (I mean for real behind the wheel as opposed to compare stats on paper). We could then report them back to this blog.

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[sflgator]

Originally Posted by Mr. Happy

Congrats on your mod. I'd love to try a Renntech flash to compare to my K1 flash. I'm sure the difference is more in the feel than in the performance per se.

Before making my decision, I made extensive research on others including Renntech. Living in Toronto, I had to send my ECU to the US anyway so going to this stress was required to access the extra power.

To readers of this thread: if you have a C63 tuned with Renntech and live in the Toronto area, please let me know. It would be great to compare the differences with my Kleemann K1 tune (I mean for real behind the wheel as opposed to compare stats on paper). We could then report them back to this blog.

I sent a PM to another Forum member who lives close by; he has the Kleemann K1 ecu flash tune, so I'll let everyone know if we get together. I'm interested in the differences as well, but I have a feeling the two ecu flashes are very similar.

[propain]

Originally Posted by sflgator

I sent a PM to another Forum member who lives close by; he has the Kleemann K1 ecu flash tune, so I'll let everyone know if we get together. I'm interested in the differences as well, but I have a feeling the two ecu flashes are very similar.

Im sure its the same. Its cool that you have local support for it and you didnt have to remove it and not have a car for 2 days.

Did you speak with them about flashing it back to stock for your services and then putting it back on when your service is done? That also would be worth the extra cost.

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by propain

Im sure its the same. Its cool that you have local support for it and you didnt have to remove it and not have a car for 2 days.

Did you speak with them about flashing it back to stock for your services and then putting it back on when your service is done? That also would be worth the extra cost.

Yes, but also inquiring about a "mod-friendly" SA is good too.

[wadgras44]

Awesome 335i vs c63 comparison but my question should have been more precise - I was wondering if the adding the RENNtech tune to the c63 is as similarly profound of an experience as adding a V3 to a stock 335i.

I'm guessing no b/c of the dyno numbers as well as the fact that it's already a beast out of the box.

But the before / after PROcede is my baseline, so I'd love to her your thoughts.

Originally Posted by sflgator

No comparison really; the '09 C63 AMG is just a much nicer sports sedan, imho. Although it's lacking a bit in the high-tech gadget department (although somewhat relieved with MY 2010 which adds MB Keyless Go (BMW Comfort Access), Rear-View Camera, etc.), it behaves like a real sports car. Since it was designed to compete (and beat ) the BMW M3, the C63 AMG is a real beast on the road and on the track; e.g. the deep rumble of the quad AMG exhaust is simply sublime, and it handles so much better than a stock 335i.

As far as power goes, a stock C63 AMG is just as fast as a PROcede 335i, but since it's N/A, it's power/speed is more deceptive with more linear power. Now, (b/c the C63 AMG has the same "detuned" 6.2L AMG engine as the other AMG's) an ecu flash tuned C63 AMG like my RENNtech C63 AMG...let's just say that PROcede v3 (or JB3) 335i's should either try to follow or simply get out of the way. Yes, a tuned C63 AMG is definitely faster (with approx 511HP / 480 lb-ft TQ) than a tuned 335i, although I haven't tested that theory yet.

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by wadgras44

Awesome 335i vs c63 comparison but my question should have been more precise - I was wondering if the adding the RENNtech tune to the c63 is as similarly profound of an experience as adding a V3 to a stock 335i.

I'm guessing no b/c of the dyno numbers as well as the fact that it's already a beast out of the box.

But the before / after PROcede is my baseline, so I'd love to her your thoughts.

Not in the sense of going from 300-320BHP - 400-410BHP like in a stock 335i to a PROcede v3 335i, no. But, adding another +60BHP / +37 lb-ft TQ to the C63 AMG is VERY noticeable; my car was fast before (stock), but now, it just pulls like a freight train!!!!! I should be dyno'ing sometime in the next couple weeks, and I will post the dyno (w/o a baseline, but we all know what these cars baseline dyno range is). Going from 451HP /443 lb-ft TQ to ~ 511HP / 480 lb-ft TQ is still significant!!! Although my car is not as fast as say a GT-R, it's still a lot closer to the GT-R than a PROcede 335i, imho.

[qship5]

Another happy ReNNtech stage 2 customer...All I need now is LTs and wider rear tires! The car is a monster!

[lomita]

Great write up. Thanks for sharing your fun success story. We're around 3800 miles now with our tune from Evosport. The rear tires are disappearing quickly. Have you tried running in the ESP Sport Mode yet? Hold onto your hat, another thrill awaits you!

[Boost Gomez]

Originally Posted by sflgator

Not in the sense of going from 300-320BHP - 400-410BHP like in a stock 335i to a PROcede v3 335i, no. But, adding another +60BHP / +37 lb-ft TQ to the C63 AMG is VERY noticeable; my car was fast before (stock), but now, it just pulls like a freight train!!!!! I should be dyno'ing sometime in the next couple weeks, and I will post the dyno (w/o a baseline, but we all know what these cars baseline dyno range is). Going from 451HP /443 lb-ft TQ to ~ 511HP / 480 lb-ft TQ is still significant!!! Although my car is not as fast as say a GT-R, it's still a lot closer to the GT-R than a PROcede 335i, imho.

From a roll your modded C63 keep up with the GT-R.

[James@ACGSD]

Originally Posted by propain

RENtech: $3500 ECU tune.

K1 Tune: $1545
K2 Tune: $2485 + Labor = $3367


Congrats on your tune! Cant wait to do mine. I understand why you did what you did. Local support and instant gratification. But the K1 tune is the same as the RENtech for $1500 less. You can get the K2 tune with headers ect for a gain of 90HP for less than the RENtech tune.

I honestly dont see why they charge so much.

K1 tune is $1495, top upgrade to K2 from a K1 then it is $2495 for the headers.

If you are stock, to go directly to K2 will cost $3990. Price is without install, Headers are available and instock...

We have the proper equipment to do both Kleemann and RENNtech ECU upgrades on the C63 same day, as long as we are given enough time to give RENNtech or Kleemann time to send the file back to us.

To the OT, I'm glad to hear that you are enjoying your RT tune, hartmut is a wealth of knowledge and runs a top notch operation.

[propain]

Originally Posted by James@ACGSD

K1 tune is $1495, top upgrade to K2 from a K1 then it is $2495 for the headers.

If you are stock, to go directly to K2 will cost $3990. Price is without install, Headers are available and instock...

We have the proper equipment to do both Kleemann and RENNtech ECU upgrades on the C63 same day, as long as we are given enough time to give RENNtech or Kleemann time to send the file back to us.

To the OT, I'm glad to hear that you are enjoying your RT tune, hartmut is a wealth of knowledge and runs a top notch operation.

Yeah, that must have been the price I got. K1 to K2. Not K1 and K2. Either way, best of luck to the OP.

How many hour of labor for the K2 install?

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by propain

Yeah, that must have been the price I got. K1 to K2. Not K1 and K2. Either way, best of luck to the OP.

How many hour of labor for the K2 install?

Thanks, propain. After running around in my new RENNtech C63 the few days, I cannot begin to tell everyone just how much faster my C63 is after the RENNtech ecu flash tune!! I may be getting together with another cool Forum member this week, so we can hang out for a bit and compare cars...he has a Kleemann K1 C63. I honestly didn't think that ~ +60WHP / +39 lb-ft TQ would make this car so much more beastly, he he!!!

[sflgator]

FWIW, I met up with soldier2304 (very cool guy btw!!! ) and his friend in a stock C63 AMG. Soldier2304's C63 AMG has a Kleemann K1 ecu flash + K&N air filters + straight pipes in his exhaust (although I'm sure that's zero HP gain, but it sounds absolutely incredible!!! ) vs. my RENNtech stage2 C63 AMG (everything else stock). I still have not dyno'd my car and unfortunately, soldier2304 hasn't had the opportunity to dyno his car yet either; I hope to go to RENNtech next week to get mine on the dyno.

Just as I expected though...soldier2304 and I were just about even on a couple 3rd gear highway rolling runs from ~ 60mph-110mph. I say just about even because it seemed as if Soldier2304's C63 AMG was pulling ever so slightly. However, this could be attributed to the fact that he has the K&N air filters (for possibly more airflow and a few extra HP) AND the fact that I have approx. 100lbs. of work stuff in my trunk. In addition, I believe he let the car shift in Auto Sport mode, while I was shifting with the paddles in M mode. All things being equal, I think it would be a good bet to say that we would absolutely be nose-to-nose for the entire runs.

I think if we had better conditions with less traffic (and no rain ), it would've made for some better runs. Because of traffic, we weren't really able to run with his friend in the stock C63 AMG. However, all-in-all, I would say that the Kleemann K1 ecu flash is nearly identical to the RENNtech stage2 ecu flash tune. As Soldier2304 said, "there's no doubt that your car is well tuned."

Sorry, guys no videos...just a couple of friendly runs between Forum members! Thanks, Soldier2304...great to meet you and I look forward to hanging out with you again. btw -- your car sounds absolutely amazing with your straight pipes!!!!

[FormulaZR]

Originally Posted by sflgator

FWIW, I met up with soldier2304 (very cool guy btw!!! ) and his friend in a stock C63 AMG. Soldier2304's C63 AMG has a Kleemann K1 ecu flash + K&N air filters + straight pipes in his exhaust (although I'm sure that's zero HP gain, but it sounds absolutely incredible!!! ) vs. my RENNtech stage2 C63 AMG (everything else stock). I still have not dyno'd my car and unfortunately, soldier2304 hasn't had the opportunity to dyno his car yet either; I hope to go to RENNtech next week to get mine on the dyno.

Just as I expected though...soldier2304 and I were just about even on a couple 3rd gear highway rolling runs from ~ 60mph-110mph. I say just about even because it seemed as if Soldier2304's C63 AMG was pulling ever so slightly. However, this could be attributed to the fact that he has the K&N air filters (for possibly more airflow and a few extra HP) AND the fact that I have approx. 100lbs. of work stuff in my trunk. In addition, I believe he let the car shift in Auto Sport mode, while I was shifting with the paddles in M mode. All things being equal, I think it would be a good bet to say that we would absolutely be nose-to-nose for the entire runs.

I think if we had better conditions with less traffic (and no rain ), it would've made for some better runs. Because of traffic, we weren't really able to run with his friend in the stock C63 AMG. However, all-in-all, I would say that the Kleemann K1 ecu flash is nearly identical to the RENNtech stage2 ecu flash tune. As Soldier2304 said, "there's no doubt that your car is well tuned."

Sorry, guys no videos...just a couple of friendly runs between Forum members! Thanks, Soldier2304...great to meet you and I look forward to hanging out with you again. btw -- your car sounds absolutely amazing with your straight pipes!!!!

You should have to turn in your AMG emblems for not keeping a cheap video camera in the car at all times! LOL...glad you got have some fun!

[Mr. Happy]

Wow! Great review. Next time, you should trade cars for a run or 2 just to see if it behaves differently,

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by Mr. Happy

Wow! Great review. Next time, you should trade cars for a run or 2 just to see if it behaves differently,

Yeah, didn't have time (and it began to rain) today to do that, but maybe we'll do that next time.

[soldier2304]

Originally Posted by sflgator

FWIW, I met up with soldier2304 (very cool guy btw!!! ) and his friend in a stock C63 AMG. Soldier2304's C63 AMG has a Kleemann K1 ecu flash + K&N air filters + straight pipes in his exhaust (although I'm sure that's zero HP gain, but it sounds absolutely incredible!!! ) vs. my RENNtech stage2 C63 AMG (everything else stock). I still have not dyno'd my car and unfortunately, soldier2304 hasn't had the opportunity to dyno his car yet either; I hope to go to RENNtech next week to get mine on the dyno.

Just as I expected though...soldier2304 and I were just about even on a couple 3rd gear highway rolling runs from ~ 60mph-110mph. I say just about even because it seemed as if Soldier2304's C63 AMG was pulling ever so slightly. However, this could be attributed to the fact that he has the K&N air filters (for possibly more airflow and a few extra HP) AND the fact that I have approx. 100lbs. of work stuff in my trunk. In addition, I believe he let the car shift in Auto Sport mode, while I was shifting with the paddles in M mode. All things being equal, I think it would be a good bet to say that we would absolutely be nose-to-nose for the entire runs.

I think if we had better conditions with less traffic (and no rain ), it would've made for some better runs. Because of traffic, we weren't really able to run with his friend in the stock C63 AMG. However, all-in-all, I would say that the Kleemann K1 ecu flash is nearly identical to the RENNtech stage2 ecu flash tune. As Soldier2304 said, "there's no doubt that your car is well tuned."

Sorry, guys no videos...just a couple of friendly runs between Forum members! Thanks, Soldier2304...great to meet you and I look forward to hanging out with you again. btw -- your car sounds absolutely amazing with your straight pipes!!!!

Indeed, it was all in good ol'fun. I can honestly say the same thing, our cars are probably pushing same number range from 510-520 hp to the crank IMO. If it wouldnt had been for the rain we would of done more runs but it was still good enough just for comparison purposes. I am looking forward to the M5 race and will defintely take a video BTW did you look up the video i told about the stage2 renntech C63 against the stock M5? If not then here it is! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4718vN0kL3M

[1st amg]

Hey "sflgator", when you say soldiers car sounded amazing, in what way, is it much louder, does it sound more "muscle car" , does it sound obtrusive? The reason I ask this is even if he posted the video of his car, it is sort of difficult to hear the difference, the videos probably wont do it justice, so an unbiased opinion would be great, I guess the question to you would be....is that your next mod to replace the cats with straigth pipes? Thanks for your input, seeing from your posts you seem to be someone who doesnt lack intelligence or is a goof.

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by soldier2304

Indeed, it was all in good ol'fun. I can honestly say the same thing, our cars are probably pushing same number range from 510-520 hp to the crank IMO. If it wouldnt had been for the rain we would of done more runs but it was still good enough just for comparison purposes. I am looking forward to the M5 race and will defintely take a video BTW did you look up the video i told about the stage2 renntech C63 against the stock M5? If not then here it is! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4718vN0kL3M

Great video...thanks!!!! Well, I guess we know where we stand in the "pecking order" then; not bad at all...loved the way that RENNtech C63 AMG kept pulling on the M5. I think the intake (if well done and allows for more airflow) might yield another 5-10WHP, but I also think adding some higher-flow drop-in air filters to the oem stock airbox probably yields similar gains, imho. Let's try again and line up together at the dragstrip when the weather cools down in 2-3 months.

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by 1st amg

Hey "sflgator", when you say soldiers car sounded amazing, in what way, is it much louder, does it sound more "muscle car" , does it sound obtrusive? The reason I ask this is even if he posted the video of his car, it is sort of difficult to hear the difference, the videos probably wont do it justice, so an unbiased opinion would be great, I guess the question to you would be....is that your next mod to replace the cats with straight pipes? Thanks for your input, seeing from your posts you seem to be someone who doesn't lack intelligence or is a goof.

Soldier's C63 AMG is definitely louder and "meaner" sounding than an oem stock exhaust like mine; although loud at WOT, it doesn't seem intrusive or obnoxious at lower and/or cruising speeds though (at least from outside the car). Personally, I've decided to leave my oem exhaust as is for now; as great as his sounds, I just don't want anyone touching my exhaust in fear they might mess it up. I might do it later (and would only do what Soldier did), but it's not a priority for me right now...I love the way the oem stock exhaust sounds anyway and to me, it's also plenty loud.

[andrew89930]

this is just a guess but basically all ECU reflashes mimic the E63 or SL63 stats right ? I like renntech for their long history of AMG mods. However Kleeman has a great rap and does the flash for much cheaper . Just my view here

[sflgator]

Originally Posted by andrew89930

this is just a guess but basically all ECU reflashes mimic the E63 or SL63 stats right ? I like renntech for their long history of AMG mods. However Kleeman has a great rap and does the flash for much cheaper . Just my view here

Basically, yes...some of the better ecu flashes (e.g. RENNtech, Kleemann, Powerchip) are bringing the MB factory "detuned" C63 AMG engine back up to its typical specs like in the other AMG engines...that is ~ 510HP-520HP. Anything above that would be really tuning this AMG engine further (which is possible, but may possibly sacrifice engine safety limits with just an ecu tune; other additional mods may also increase HP/TQ, but not necessarily without sacrificing safety).

[vitamink]

Originally Posted by sflgator

Basically, yes...some of the better ecu flashes (e.g. RENNtech, Kleemann, Powerchip) are bringing the MB factory "detuned" C63 AMG engine back up to its typical specs like in the other AMG engines...that is ~ 510HP-520HP. Anything above that would be really tuning this AMG engine further (which is possible, but may possibly sacrifice engine safety limits with just an ecu tune; other additional mods may also increase HP/TQ, but not necessarily without sacrificing safety).

Hmmm. Interesting. so you are saying probably Kleemann stage 1 is safe for the engine but other stages maybe not good for the egngine for the long run?

[Mr. Happy]

Originally Posted by vitamink

Hmmm. Interesting. so you are saying probably Kleemann stage 1 is safe for the engine but other stages maybe not good for the egngine for the long run?

A Kleemann K1 or a Renntech Stage 2 is just to bring the original power back. It does not "push" the engine further than what it was designed for.

[vitamink]

hmm now I am really interested after hearing this. I worried about the engine for ecu flash.... need start to save money.. no more LV bag gift