My Stock E55 vs Mthis Modded C63

[Murtaza]

Originally Posted by E55AMGGG04 Thank god we have you here to educate the uneducated youth. Are you in the NY area because i'm sure my buddy mthis will glady run you. See where it says location under my name, that denotes my area of residence. Another note to add about the Evo 3 not running properly, the owner of the car works in the industry of car tuning; you think maybe he'd know if something was up Originally Posted by Dads C63 MURTAZA - your car is obviously VERY fast no doubt. Do you have any 60-130 numbers to compare? What does it run in the 1/4 mile or are all your runs on the street from a roll? Have you had it on a dyno? I have been considering the M6 and would like more information please. I have done runs from a dig and from a roll, mostly from a roll. No 1/4 mile runs or dyno yet. My buddy has a vbox, hopefully we should get some 60-130 numbers soon. The M6 that beat me pulled a 9.6 60-130. What are the best 60-130 numbers for the C63?

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[Dads C63]

MURTAZA,
I don't know yet. Don't usually do any street racing. I drag race and road race. I am going to order the Performance Box so I can see what it runs 60-130 so I can see how it compares to you all. I am sure it will be competitive but I don't know yet. Will advise as soon as I can.
Keep racing but be safe!

[Murtaza]

Originally Posted by Dads C63

MURTAZA,
I don't know yet. Don't usually do any street racing. I drag race and road race. I am going to order the Performance Box so I can see what it runs 60-130 so I can see how it compares to you all. I am sure it will be competitive but I don't know yet. Will advise as soon as I can.
Keep racing but be safe!

Just noticed your 1/4 mile time, wow excellent! Despite all the bickering in this thread I'm pretty sure I would get schooled in the 1/4 mile, this car is very tricky to launch. I have taken a stock E63 from a dig till 70 or so but it was stock.

We have a good race crew down here and keep it as safe as possible with no civilians on the road (for the most part).

[Vic55]

Originally Posted by Murtaza

Just noticed your 1/4 mile time, wow excellent! Despite all the bickering in this thread I'm pretty sure I would get schooled in the 1/4 mile, this car is very tricky to launch. I have taken a stock E63 from a dig till 70 or so but it was stock.

We have a good race crew down here and keep it as safe as possible with no civilians on the road (for the most part).

Yes, our mexican roads are smooth and federale free!!

I think most forget Alex, that the M6 is not a quarter miler and would get its a$$ handed to it via a dig. The runs where Murtaza beats the C63 go well past those quarter mile trap speeds; places where gearing, drivetrain/parasitic loss, COed, play large(r) roles.

[Dads C63]

As soon as I can get a PBox I will let you know what it does. Its just so freaking hot down here in sunny Florida!! It was 93 today!! Kills the performance.

Vic55 - I hear what you are saying about the higher speeds but we just made the mile run in Miami at over 100 degrees and went well over the 170 mark so its not so slow up top either. I can't brag because I don't know about the 60-130. My car is very similar to the Silver Dragon so we probably run similar times. Will advise.

[Vic55]

Originally Posted by Dads C63

As soon as I can get a PBox I will let you know what it does. Its just so freaking hot down here in sunny Florida!! It was 93 today!! Kills the performance.

Vic55 - I hear what you are saying about the higher speeds but we just made the mile run in Miami at over 100 degrees and went well over the 170 mark so its not so slow up top either. I can't brag because I don't know about the 60-130. My car is very similar to the Silver Dragon so we probably run similar times. Will advise.

Nice work on the mile!!!

I like the 60-130 times that the PCar boys use- its the real world time that is most realistic for street comparos. Im sure your 60-130 is very good if its like the dragon

[Murtaza]

Originally Posted by Vic55

The runs where Murtaza beats the C63 go well past those quarter mile trap speeds; places where gearing, drivetrain/parasitic loss, COed, play large(r) roles.

I see your point but that doesn't really apply here. We did 40-50mph 2nd gear rolls and I would immediately jump half a car off the honk...wish I had better vids of that. At lower speeds 1st gear rolls are great but I couldn't do that with Josh since my tires are almost bald and I'd go sideways into Drew

Up top I wasn't pulling away from the Evo 3 hard like I do vs the 55 amgs, like I said before his car has balls up top.

[Vic55]

Originally Posted by Murtaza

I see your point but that doesn't really apply here. We did 40-50mph 2nd gear rolls and I would immediately jump half a car off the honk...wish I had better vids of that. At lower speeds 1st gear rolls are great but I couldn't do that with Josh since my tires are almost bald and I'd go sideways into Drew

Up top I wasn't pulling away from the Evo 3 hard like I do vs the 55 amgs, like I said before his car has balls up top.

Of course my point applies, I just think you misinterpreted what I was saying. From a roll at 40-50 is where you would start to pull back some of the advantage that an AMG might otherwise get from a dig. But since you started at that number/speed your advantage was gained immediately. The throttle response on the S85 engine is amazingly quick so I can see how you got that half car lead.

FWIW he did post that you were jumping right at the third horn and he was not. Not trying to start anything but I wonder if you saw this post: See "Silver Dragon" post here:

Click Here

Full Thread with Vids

[nrgy]

Originally Posted by Murtaza

Up top I wasn't pulling away from the Evo 3 hard like I do vs the 55 amgs, like I said before his car has balls up top.

Simply judging by the vids, I don't see you pulling hard from the Evo C63 at any speeds I know the angle isn't the greatest, but to me it looks like at most 1/2 car at any point during the race, and this is what Josh is saying as well. Either way it is clear they are both very fast cars and evenly matched.

[nrgy]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

I've seen only one 60-130 for a C63 with headers and tune and it's 10.48sec, the fastest stock M5 time is 10.48sec as well, a modded M6 has done it in 9.62sec, E55 stock I've seen a 12.1sec 60-130 so far, but it was hot out when he ran that time.

I just wanted to point out that the 60-130 of 10.48 sec for the C63, which is the only 60-130 I know of for the C up to this point, was not running LT headers. That run was recorded in July of '08, and the owner said it was making 500hp at the crank according to the info I could find. Who knows how accurate that hp rating is, but I'm guessing he was running K2. I would imagine those of us running LTs should do significantly better, in the 9's like DLSJ5 was saying.

I received my PBox last week and botched my 60-130 over the weekend as I let off 1 mph to soon! Hopefully the weather clears up and I can get another stab at it, but I'm hoping I will break into the 9s.

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by Dads C63

As soon as I can get a PBox I will let you know what it does. Its just so freaking hot down here in sunny Florida!! It was 93 today!! Kills the performance.

Vic55 - I hear what you are saying about the higher speeds but we just made the mile run in Miami at over 100 degrees and went well over the 170 mark so its not so slow up top either. I can't brag because I don't know about the 60-130. My car is very similar to the Silver Dragon so we probably run similar times. Will advise.

On 6speed there is a C63 with tune/headers that hit 10.48 sec, 60-130, I would say that is not relative to what it can do, that setup should be in the 9's from what I've seen from Josh's car.

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by nrgy

I just wanted to point out that the 60-130 of 10.48 sec for the C63, which is the only 60-130 I know of for the C up to this point, was not running LT headers. That run was recorded in July of '08, and the owner said it was making 500hp at the crank according to the info I could find. Who knows how accurate that hp rating is, but I'm guessing he was running K2. I would imagine those of us running LTs should do significantly better, in the 9's like DLSJ5 was saying.

I received my PBox last week and botched my 60-130 over the weekend as I let off 1 mph to soon! Hopefully the weather clears up and I can get another stab at it, but I'm hoping I will break into the 9s.

Good points, and I just rememberd that another member here, Qship, with just a tune stated he hit 10.1, but did not send it in or post up the graph. Just like with ET and trap speeds conditions will play a roll.

[nrgy]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

On 6speed there is a C63 with tune/headers that hit 10.48 sec, 60-130, I would say that is not relative to what it can do, that setup should be in the 9's from what I've seen from Josh's car.

Haha, yeah, 6speed is actually where I was digging that info up from The reason why I think he was running the K2 is because of the time frame. No one has been running long tubes that I know of until this summer, and the Kleeman headers are far from headers. They are basically high flowing manifolds, which imo do nothing. I think the gains from the K2 are coming from the high flow cats more than anything.

Another member here gained 40 rwhp when he switched out the Kleeman K2 manifolds for the MHP long tube headers fwiw.

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by nrgy

Haha, yeah, 6speed is actually where I was digging that info up from The reason why I think he was running the K2 is because of the time frame. No one has been running long tubes that I know of until this summer, and the Kleeman headers are far from headers. They are basically high flowing manifolds, which imo do nothing. I think the gains from the K2 are coming from the high flow cats more than anything.

Another member here gained 40 rwhp when he switched out the Kleeman K2 manifolds for the MHP long tube headers fwiw.

I believe it, Josh's car is much faster than my buddies tuned C63, so much potential in that motor NA, I'm gonna need FI to catch Josh and Alex. FWIW Josh ran even with a 6MT Supercharged E92.

[nrgy]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

I'm gonna need FI to catch Josh and Alex.

Yeah, at least you guys have that option I'm jealous of you M3 guys. Here I thought the 63 would be the first to have F/I kits available, but nope. Plus you have so many options to choose from! I really like that ESS kit, looks clean and unobtrusive.

[Murtaza]

Originally Posted by Vic55

Of course my point applies, I just think you misinterpreted what I was saying. From a roll at 40-50 is where you would start to pull back some of the advantage that an AMG might otherwise get from a dig. But since you started at that number/speed your advantage was gained immediately. The throttle response on the S85 engine is amazingly quick so I can see how you got that half car lead.

FWIW he did post that you were jumping right at the third horn and he was not. Not trying to start anything but I wonder if you saw this post: See "Silver Dragon" post here:

Click Here

Full Thread with Vids

I did and it's sad the first time I heard about it was here instead of during the runs or having coffee after wards...

Stuff like this makes getting up for the runs a lot less worth it.

[hhughes1]

Originally Posted by nrgy

Yeah, at least you guys have that option I'm jealous of you M3 guys. Here I thought the 63 would be the first to have F/I kits available, but nope. Plus you have so many options to choose from! I really like that ESS kit, looks clean and unobtrusive.

I assume you would like something like this:

[LP560-4]

I would love to see a Kleemann K2 c63 vs MHP tune / LT headers c63.

[RNS-11Z]

Originally Posted by LP560-4

I would love to see a Kleemann K2 c63 vs MHP tune / LT headers c63.

any c63 with tune + headers should easyly beat a c63 with tune only. headers make too much of a difference.

h.

[Boost Gomez]

Originally Posted by RNS-11Z

any c63 with tune + headers should easyly beat a c63 with tune only. headers make too much of a difference.

h.

K2 is tune + headers. I would like to see that match-up as well but I'm fairly certain the MHP equipped C63 would pull on the K2.

[nrgy]

Originally Posted by Boost Gomez

K2 is tune + headers. I would like to see that match-up as well but I'm fairly certain the MHP equipped C63 would pull on the K2.

As I pointed out a couple posts above, K2 does not really include what I would call even shorty headers. They are more of a high flow manifold (look very similar to the stock manifolds), whereas Renntech and MKB have shorty headers. MHP and I think Evosport are the only ones who have a true long tube header.

Here's a photo comparo, the K2 setup pic was taken by hhughes, following a pic I took of the MHP headers:





But yeah, I have no doubt a LT setup would pull significantly on a K2 setup. A 44 rwhp gain that hhughes achieved is huge imo. Oh, and yeah hhughes, that supercharger pic you posted is exactly what I'm looking for haha. Although maybe not in orange

[Even Money]

So with a LT header set-up, are there any cats, hi-flo metallic or otherwise? Also are these equal length, or do they need to be? That pic above looks to be the ultimate setup for max hp/tq gains, I'm just curious to know the "why" behind it. Oh, and does the sound draw attention? Thanks..

[nrgy]

I do have a set of high flow metallic cats in my setup. I think I may be the only one, everyone else I know of is running catless. You can kinda see them in the pic above, right behind the merge collectors where the tubes meet. They are 300 cell, and same diameter as the mid pipes.

These are not equal length. I think there simply wasn't enough room to do so, but don't quote me on that. Also, there was a discussion about this awhile back but basically for the power we're making it doesn't really matter. I'm sure this can be debated, and as I'm no expert on this I can't really comment further.

As far as the sound drawing attention....this would be a big YES. It bothered me at first I have to admit. I was afraid I would be drawing negative attention and/or having the police called on me, but all those worries are gone. Either I've adjusted, or the setup has broken in or something, but I love it now. I get a lot of thumbs up or jaw dropped looks when I floor it. I never seem to be tailgated either.

[Even Money]

That setup looks really nice. I just noticed you're in the Pac NW. Did you have the work done up here and if so can you recommend the shop? Thanks..

[transferred]

Originally Posted by Murtaza

I did and it's sad the first time I heard about it was here instead of during the runs or having coffee after wards...

Stuff like this makes getting up for the runs a lot less worth it.

Agreed. The links posted read kinda Bush league imo