2002 CLK55 AMG vs. 2004 Corvette ZO6?

[King///AMG]

I work with a guy here that just bought a 2004 Corvette ZO6. It is completely stock. So, we were talking and I told him I had a 2002 CLK55 AMG coupe. So, one conversation after the next he wants to race me. And a whole bunch of co-workers want to watch. The only mod I have on my car is Staggered 19" AMG wheels. I checked out 0-60 numbers and they aren't lookin too good on my side. Vette claims 4.1s while AMG claims 4.9s. There is one thing tho, this kid isn't too good with a stick. So, can I beat him? I don't wanna make a fool outta myself in front of all my co-workers. The race is scheduled in another month when my car will be out... I really haven't raced anyone with such close 0-60 times. Which method should I use? Touchshift, Auto, Brake-torque to xxxx rpms? Advice?

To remove this ad, register today or login if you already are registered!

[430]

Vette's are pretty easy cars to drive fast. On the other hand if he misses a shift it is all over. If you have a safe place to run go for it. You might lose but won't make a fool out of yourself.

Leave the car in full auto. As far as brake torquing the biggest problem I in acheiving good numbers is traction. All that torque and narrow 245's in back aren't a good combination.

[King///AMG]

Originally Posted by 430

Vette's are pretty easy cars to drive fast. On the other hand if he misses a shift it is all over. If you have a safe place to run go for it. You might lose but won't make a fool out of yourself.

Leave the car in full auto. As far as brake torquing the biggest problem I in acheiving good numbers is traction. All that torque and narrow 245's in back aren't a good combination.

265's in back fo me baby. We decided that we are gonna do this. Ppl here just keep pumping us up.

Ok, so I will leave ESP on and use Auto Mode. I guess the launch matters the most, as well as keeping the pedal mashed the whole time. To be safe, we might hit up this local track here. If not, backroad it is.

I will def. take a camera...

[oracledba]

good luck man i'm pulling for you
be safe
and kick some butt

[King///AMG]

Originally Posted by oracledba

good luck man i'm pulling for you
be safe
and kick some butt

Thanks

[Chappy]

You'll get your best times with ESP off and by rolling the throttle.

[FThornton666]

Youll get him off the launch, try and just get him to go to 60, because after 60 i think even a bad driver with a stick should catch up. Pray for a mishift, do not go from a roll. Also have fun.

[CHB]

His car:
Horsepower 405 @6000rpm
Torque 400 @4800rpm
Curb Weight 3,118 lbs

Your car:
Horsepower 342 @5500rpm
Torque 376 @3000rpm
Curb Weight 3,485 lbs.

The numbers are not in your favor, but if he miss shifts, and you get a good launch, it could be close. Good luck

[ProjectC55]

I think you'll be toast! They have been known to give a W211 E55 a run for the money! And by the way PLEASE LEAVE the ESP off! For racing. Good Luck!

[AMG///Merc]

Originally Posted by Chappy

You'll get your best times with ESP off and by rolling the throttle.

If you're even a little too aggresive with the throttle (Incredibly easy to do when there's a crowd around), the ESP cuts in too aggresively, which feels like you're almost going to stall. If that happens, you're toast, even if he misses two gear changes...

Unfortunately, ireegardless of launch method, chances are that you are going to lose. The 04 Z06 is a monster, very easy to launch, and consistently places in the low 4 sec 0 to 60 mark. This guy will have to be one really bad driver for you to win. Hopefully he will be overconfident, and won't take you seriously enough. Anyway, I wish you the best of luck! Oh, and whatever you do, don't smack-talk before hand, in case you do lose!!


Best regards,
Matt

[RVakharia]

Remember, to take pictures & vids!! If he's a n00b with the Z06, the ball will be in your court. Good luck with it...

[MikeL]

Like others have said, the Z06 out muscles the AMG. With stick cars, to get that 4.0-4.1 0-60 time, the guy in the Z06 must nail his launch, meaning he has to rev his car to the optimum RPM for launching, and nail it perfectly, with limited wheel spin, etc. You have an Auto AMG, all you have to do is powerbrake a little and stomp on it, with esp off. If they guy cant drive/launch, you'll get him out of the hole. If he knows what hes doing and gets a good launch, its bye bye AMG.

[King///AMG]

Thanks for all your comments. Just want the weather to get better so I can pull the beast outta the garage. I will have some friends take pics and some video and most likey will add it to this thread.

ESP off, a 'lil brake torque and Auto mode it is. Even being that the ZO6 is a fast car, the AMG will put up a fight no doubt. ...And thats all worth it...

[karl k]

I traded my 2002 C5 stick Vette for the 2002 CLK 44 AMG.

While the numbers were even, the MB felt much faster!

Good luck, lower your tire pressure and use nitrogen in the tires.

[oracledba]

one things for sure, your car is a hell of a lot nicer than the vette IMO.
love the 2 piece 19" amg rims and obsidian black. stunning ...

[DerekFSU]

Anyone who thinks an O6 is easy to drive is on crack. They are notoriously difficult to launch and speed shift without spinning BAD. I saw a newbie last week drive his to a 13.7 cause his wheelspin on his PS2's was no bad. I ate one for breakfast this morning with a good driver who ran a 12.3. I've seen a stock M3 beat one cause of the wheelspin going into second and again into third.

Poor mouth him and then race him for fun. It's a vette, they're suppose to win.

[King320]

Yeh, go for it. Just make sure you do have a safe spot for doing it...nothing would suck more than to get pulled or worse kill someone. I wouldnt even worry about it too much...if you look at the kill stories forum you'll see i beat a Saleen Ford Focus N20 quite badly tonight and that car is quick when it uses its stock nitrous system (Which im sure the guy didnt do). Anything can happen man. I've heard of a stock SLK 230 beating the crap out of an E46 M3. The M3's engine blew up (as they often did before they went back to cast iron blocks) but thats beside the point!

[Improviz]

....both cars are kind of hindered in the fast launch department by their enourmous torque. He's got a few advantages: a limited slip diff, and wider tires (I think they've got 295's, but may be off a bit...but definitely wider than 265's). Otoh, if he's not very good with a stick, he can bog or spin on the launch, and/or just screw up once he's going...so if you can nail a pretty good launch, you'll be able to keep him at bay for a while.

I ran a guy in a Z06 once who launched poorly, and it took him until about 80-85 or so to catch up, at which point he just blew by. I raced another guy in a modded one who knew how to launch, and he ate my lunch.

But if you can master the launch, you'll be OK, or should at least make a respectable showing. Technique is: traction control off, left-foot brake, right-foot throttle, rpm at around 1000-1200 or so (maybe more, maybe less; try this a few times to get the hang of it, and see what RPMs you can get to without frying the tires). *Yank* left foot off of brake, wait a fraction of a second to get some weight transferred to the back end, then roll the throttle as Chappy said, i.e. give it a "fast squeeze", NOT A STOMP (if you stomp it, you'll spin like a mofo and lose), where you kind of increase in a nonlinear fashion, increasing the speed at which you press the accelerator the further down you get it. Idea is to get just a bit of spin.

What you're trying to do is to let the weight transfer a bit to the rear end to increase traction while feeding in throttle as rapidly as possible without busting the rear end loose. Yanking the foot off the brake starts it moving, and the squeeze keeps it right on the edge, which is where you want to be.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

[clk55fan]

Don't forget to let some air out of the rears!!

I can't recommend what psi to load the rears to, but definitely loose some
of the air. Maybe someone here knows what psi is the best for dragging.

Good luck!

[AMG///Merc]

Originally Posted by DerekFSU

Anyone who thinks an O6 is easy to drive is on crack. They are notoriously difficult to launch and speed shift without spinning BAD. I saw a newbie last week drive his to a 13.7 cause his wheelspin on his PS2's was no bad. I ate one for breakfast this morning with a good driver who ran a 12.3. I've seen a stock M3 beat one cause of the wheelspin going into second and again into third.

Poor mouth him and then race him for fun. It's a vette, they're suppose to win.

I guess it comes down to experience, and knowing before hand what to expect. Granted, I only drove a Z06 once, and it was the 385 hp version (I want to say that it was an 01), but that car was remarkably easy to launch. I've learned that much more often than not, the best way to launch most cars is by doing so less agressively than you might expect. I knew not to launch at much more than 1300-1400 rpm, and with that few rpm, and little clutch slip (But not dumping, or side-stepping off of it), I got a fantastic launch, with just enough wheel spin to prevent the engine from bogging down, but not so much as to where the tires wouldn't hook up. Feathering the clutch pedal lightly rather than slamming it down to the floor made from a very nice, clean 1st to 2nd shift as well. I was doing this with one hand too (My left arm is paralyzed from a motorcycle accident).

Also, I wasn't racing anyone when I drove it, and I'll admit that it can be easier to flub a launch in the heat of a drag race. I think no matter what, unless the Z06 driver completely blows his launch, or unless he actually misses a gear (Versus just a slow gearchange), you're most likely going to lose. Hey, I've got the same car, and I wish that it weren't true, but facts are facts...



Best regards,
Matt

[ProjectC55]

Originally Posted by Improviz

....both cars are kind of hindered in the fast launch department by their enourmous torque. He's got a few advantages: a limited slip diff, and wider tires (I think they've got 295's, but may be off a bit...but definitely wider than 265's). Otoh, if he's not very good with a stick, he can bog or spin on the launch, and/or just screw up once he's going...so if you can nail a pretty good launch, you'll be able to keep him at bay for a while.

I ran a guy in a Z06 once who launched poorly, and it took him until about 80-85 or so to catch up, at which point he just blew by. I raced another guy in a modded one who knew how to launch, and he ate my lunch.

But if you can master the launch, you'll be OK, or should at least make a respectable showing. Technique is: traction control off, left-foot brake, right-foot throttle, rpm at around 1000-1200 or so (maybe more, maybe less; try this a few times to get the hang of it, and see what RPMs you can get to without frying the tires). *Yank* left foot off of brake, wait a fraction of a second to get some weight transferred to the back end, then roll the throttle as Chappy said, i.e. give it a "fast squeeze", NOT A STOMP (if you stomp it, you'll spin like a mofo and lose), where you kind of increase in a nonlinear fashion, increasing the speed at which you press the accelerator the further down you get it. Idea is to get just a bit of spin.

What you're trying to do is to let the weight transfer a bit to the rear end to increase traction while feeding in throttle as rapidly as possible without busting the rear end loose. Yanking the foot off the brake starts it moving, and the squeeze keeps it right on the edge, which is where you want to be.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

Wow good info here!

[monoblockz]

I have seen some good advise here..... Improviz is one of the most knowledgeable people on this board and it is clear that he knows how to get it done when it comes to driving. However, you should ask yourself how good are YOU? Remember that your palms will be sweating, your heart pounding and people will be watching. I can tell you from experience that it is extremely easy to jump on that gas and smoke the tires. You just lost if that happens. I found that in my car it was almost impossible for me to judge how the car was going to hook up with the ESP off. If you are extremely confident in your driving abilities and are able to to power brake and roll on the throttle with just the right amount of wheel spin virtually every time, you are better than I am. If you have doubts, here is a little trick that worked for me more than once. Let some air out your tires, I would run 25 PSI. On your way out to where you are going to run and as close to your run time as possible.... Turn off ESP and light the tires up. Put ESP back on and run your race. If your tires are warm and the surface is decent, ESP shouldn't interfere that much. Just my two cents.

[King///AMG]

Originally Posted by monoblockz

I have seen some good advise here..... Improviz is one of the most knowledgeable people on this board and it is clear that he knows how to get it done when it comes to driving. However, you should ask yourself how good are YOU? Remember that your palms will be sweating, your heart pounding and people will be watching. I can tell you from experience that it is extremely easy to jump on that gas and smoke the tires. You just lost if that happens. I found that in my car it was almost impossible for me to judge how the car was going to hook up with the ESP off. If you are extremely confident in your driving abilities and are able to to power brake and roll on the throttle with just the right amount of wheel spin virtually every time, you are better than I am. If you have doubts, here is a little trick that worked for me more than once. Let some air out your tires, I would run 25 PSI. On your way out to where you are going to run and as close to your run time as possible.... Turn off ESP and light the tires up. Put ESP back on and run your race. If your tires are warm and the surface is decent, ESP shouldn't interfere that much. Just my two cents.

Agree with you 100%. So much good advice here from experienced ppl. I plan on executing some trial runs before the actual day. I wanna get a good feel of throttle/traction with the ESP off. I did test a little last summer, but will concentrate on perfecting the concept this time. I did leave ESP on last summer for a few races, but the opponent was usually in a much slower car so I didnt care much at the time. I was in my friends ZO6 the other day, he was punching it at every light and was losing traction everytime. His tires are almost bald, very little tread left (which works to my advantage). Perhaps I should invest in some driving gloves to cure the "sweaty palm" syndrome.

[BenzoAMGpower]

race him, just jump the **** out of him and shut down at about 100mph... u should get him!!!! but make sure u jump the **** out of him!!

[ndabunka]

Originally Posted by CLK55AMGBENZ

Agree with you 100%. So much good advice here from experienced ppl. I plan on executing some trial runs before the actual day. I wanna get a good feel of throttle/traction with the ESP off. I did test a little last summer, but will concentrate on perfecting the concept this time. I did leave ESP on last summer for a few races, but the opponent was usually in a much slower car so I didnt care much at the time. I was in my friends ZO6 the other day, he was punching it at every light and was losing traction everytime. His tires are almost bald, very little tread left (which works to my advantage). Perhaps I should invest in some driving gloves to cure the "sweaty palm" syndrome.

Although your 19-inch wheels DO look good, they are also a fair bit heavier than the stock 17's. This will hurt you as they are heavier to turn. The fact that you have 265's on the back should help reduce wheel spin. In your case (heavier wheels and fatter tires) you SHOULD be able to get the RPM's up to about 2K before lifting off the brake. You probably won't spin at all. If you still have the 17's and could drop a set of racing radials on them, you would gain a god bit. Of course, that would be if you took it to a drag track. If it's just street, try the 2K with ESP OFF and see how it turns out. Have fun!