It's too quiet in here! Should I finally buy an 08?

[Frugal1]

Am I reading that right . . . the newest post prior to this one was the 15th?

I'm once again considering taking the plunge and getting an E320 Bluetec. I've been on and off this car since 2005. I'm not crazy about my Touareg but I still love Diesel. My head still turns everytime a W211 (or hot babe's) body goes by.

Does the lack of activity here mean everyone is completely satisfied and there are zero issues? What's new lately? Reliablilty and resale weak or strong?

There are some nice incentives that just came out and it looks like a good time to make the switch (except for the punishment they want to dole out on my poor wallet with my trade!!).

Maybe I should continue to wait for the next gen? Look what they did with the C class! The next gen E should be sweet!

Thoughts - comments?

[Untertürkheim]

I am going out to order a 2009 Bluetec. The new comand/audio/navigation system is fantastic, and I love the 211. The pictures I saw of the 212 interior were disgusting, so I am going to lock in the last of the great 211.

My only serious complaint about the E320 Bluetec are the limited options available. No more drive-dynamic seats, no avantgarde styling, no more ventilated seats, 4-zone climate control or distronic. Apparently no more designo for 2009 either.

[pinebaron]

Completely Satisfied with the 18.5k miles in the (now almost complete) 1st year.

[asg]

We have an 07 bluetec and have about 20,000miles on it and no problems here, other than the rising cost of fuel.

[dgiturbo]

Buy it. You won't regret it.

[240D 3.0T]

The 07+ models are throw-away engines and not designed to be easily repairable or rebuildable. They will be VERY expensive and difficult to fix out of warranty.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by 240D 3.0T

The 07+ models are throw-away engines and not designed to be easily repairable or rebuildable. They will be VERY expensive and difficult to fix out of warranty.

How so?

[240D 3.0T]

As Diesel Power noted in their magazine this month, crack a valve cover and you have to replace both and all cam supports as a matched set, damage a connecting rod or even take the cap off one and you have to replace all 6, bend an oil spray jet and you have to replace the entire engine block...

Its a powerful engine but it looks like the OM611 (2.2), OM612 (2.7), OM613 (3.2) inline engines will be the end of the line in easy repairs and rebuildability.

[lkchris]

Yes, get the '08 before all they have is '09s--which means no spare tire of any kind and runflat tires, all to make room for the urea tank.

[lkchris]

Originally Posted by 240D 3.0T

As Diesel Power noted in their magazine this month, crack a valve cover and you have to replace both and all cam supports as a matched set, damage a connecting rod or even take the cap off one and you have to replace all 6, bend an oil spray jet and you have to replace the entire engine block...

Cracking a valve cover, damaging a connecting rod and bending an oil spray jet are not very likely "wear" items unless, perhaps, repair is trusted to a "diesel mechanic" rather than a Mercedes mechanic.

These engines did pretty well in Laredo, averaging 139 mph over 100K miles.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by lkchris

Yes, get the '08 before all they have is '09s--which means no spare tire of any kind and runflat tires, all to make room for the urea tank.

As I understand, that will not happen until the 212 comes out as a 2010 in 2009 and that there would not be any further modification of the 211.

Also, adding the urea tank would only be necessary to make the 2009 a 50 state car, which I was also told by my dealer would not happen.

Please correct me on any of this, since it would make it much easier for me to get my 2009 Bluetec.

[240D 3.0T]

All the R, ML and GLs will get the AdBlue pee tank. The E will get it later.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by Frugal1

Am I reading that right . . . the newest post prior to this one was the 15th?

I'm once again considering taking the plunge and getting an E320 Bluetec. I've been on and off this car since 2005. I'm not crazy about my Touareg but I still love Diesel. My head still turns everytime a W211 (or hot babe's) body goes by.

Does the lack of activity here mean everyone is completely satisfied and there are zero issues? What's new lately? Reliablilty and resale weak or strong?

There are some nice incentives that just came out and it looks like a good time to make the switch (except for the punishment they want to dole out on my poor wallet with my trade!!).

Maybe I should continue to wait for the next gen? Look what they did with the C class! The next gen E should be sweet!

Thoughts - comments?

I will not buy a MB or BMW with AdBlue because it defeats the purpose of economic motoring. Mileage may still be great but ease of maintenance is vastly inferior when you need it most, when the car is old and worth little.

All the "filters" that tree-huggers so love will break down one by one (there are 3 to 4 of them) and will cost thousands to replace. Older cars can go on puffing black smoke but 2007 and newer cars will flash check engine lights and may even cut its own power!

Buy an old black smoker. They are irreplaceable.

[lkchris]

Originally Posted by 240D 3.0T

All the R, ML and GLs will get the AdBlue pee tank. The E will get it later.

What you're say is MBUSA is willing to forgo California (plus the others) sales for another year.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by lkchris

What you're say is MBUSA is willing to forgo California (plus the others) sales for another year.

Sadly it seems so.

[mb cooper]

I am delighted with my 2008 320E bluetec. My third diesel over many years.

First was 4 cylinder Peugeot (1978)--a dog. Body and engine well matched for poor quality.

Second 1994 S 350. Great car, but developed serious engine problems after 120K miles. Should have lasted much longer.

Will my 2008 edition live for 500,000 miles? Or even 200K? I do not know.
But it is a marvel of technology with excellent diesel performance, comfort, fuel economy and emission control--all positives for me.

I highly recommend it

[epmills]

The cracking a valve cover is the same deal as the current 272/273 engines, the valve cover is the upper half of the cam bearing, which is a machined match set to the lower half of the cam bearing (cyl head). I have yet to see something drastic happen to one, and I doubt it will, unless a mechanic screws something up.
I'm not too fond of the Eurea injection either, rumor has it the tank will need to be refilled about every time you need to fill up the diesel tank, at a cost of $1 US per liter for the stuff. And apparently the car will not even run if the tank goes empty due to it not meeting emissions without it.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by epmills

The cracking a valve cover is the same deal as the current 272/273 engines, the valve cover is the upper half of the cam bearing, which is a machined match set to the lower half of the cam bearing (cyl head). I have yet to see something drastic happen to one, and I doubt it will, unless a mechanic screws something up.
I'm not too fond of the Eurea injection either, rumor has it the tank will need to be refilled about every time you need to fill up the diesel tank, at a cost of $1 US per liter for the stuff. And apparently the car will not even run if the tank goes empty due to it not meeting emissions without it.

I was told that the Urea tank would only need to be refilled at the normal service intervals (13.000 miles), and I belive Urea is extremely inexpensive.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by epmills

The cracking a valve cover is the same deal as the current 272/273 engines, the valve cover is the upper half of the cam bearing, which is a machined match set to the lower half of the cam bearing (cyl head). I have yet to see something drastic happen to one, and I doubt it will, unless a mechanic screws something up.
I'm not too fond of the Eurea injection either, rumor has it the tank will need to be refilled about every time you need to fill up the diesel tank, at a cost of $1 US per liter for the stuff. And apparently the car will not even run if the tank goes empty due to it not meeting emissions without it.

Urea may be cheap but if the fluid has to be topped up by MB then it will become expensive. 3 to 4 filters would mean at least the same number of sensors. What about the check engine light? The government requires that emission problems be displayed as CEL so you will take the car back for repairs. If it says "check emission equipment" no one will spend money to do that.

Same with AdBlue. There had been talk of MB making the future diesel cars cut engine power by 50% when the pee bottle is empty. How do you like being robbed of 105 bhp suddenly when you are dragging with a Prius?

No matter what they say about "clean" diesels I shall stick with the 2006 and earlier diesels, the last of the "freedom" diesels.

[451/443=EW]

Get one while you can, you will love the car.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by 451/443=EW

Get one while you can, you will love the car.

It would be very interesting to see how the "clean" diesels, particularly the AdBlues perform on the long run with respect to reliability and more importantly maintenance costs.

Apart from emission levels the new diesels have nothing over the older ones. A lot of money for marginal gains.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

It would be very interesting to see how the "clean" diesels, particularly the AdBlues perform on the long run with respect to reliability and more importantly maintenance costs.

Apart from emission levels the new diesels have nothing over the older ones. A lot of money for marginal gains.

I would not say this is entirely true...I can promise that emission levels aside, the current E320 Bluetec is far ahead of my old 1982 or 1993 300Ds (both turbo) in terms of power, acceleration, smoothness, fuel consumption, noise, and the green stats are a great bonus.

[240D 3.0T]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

the current E320 Bluetec is far ahead of my old 1982 or 1993 300Ds (both turbo) in terms of power, acceleration, smoothness, fuel consumption, noise, and the green stats are a great bonus.

Not THAT old, he was referring to the 05-07 E320 CDI.

[Frugal1]

Well now the incentives are probably as good as they're going to get. I've never been closer but man, you guys are scaring me! I know the 07+ went with a lot more aluminum in the engine, V6 as opposed to the proven I6 and a crappier transmission but I should still be better off than with the urea models, shouldn't I ??

They're taking all of the fun out of diesel. All for what? The emissions were never that harmful to the environment anyway. The price is up, the energy in the fuel is down and now they're pummeling the poor exhaust to the point where it's cleaner going out than the air it takes in (actually true with the upcoming 09 Jetta TDI). The big rigs are polluting MORE because they're going through MORE fuel so all of the so-called benefits are being cancelled out by burning MORE fuel.

I believe global warming is real but they're swatting flies while the giant bugs are still unchecked.

If I don't buy the 08 E320 now, I probably never will. I just caught a glimpse of the 09 Acura TL. In fact, there's a lot of new stuff coming in the next year or two . . . I should probably stay "single" for now!

[madelko]

We didn't have to think very hard about buying a 10 or the 2009. From the few photos made available of the new 2010 W212, we were quite happy with the 211 style - We took delivery on a new one July 19th. The Command system is great, the spare tire is real (not runflat) there is no fluid to add for fifty-state compatibility, other than high-dollar diesel fuel, and it runs quiet, plenty of power, etc. We loaded it up minus the Pano roof - didn't want to bake my thinning hair line!

Great package, of course, this is my first new diesel in 35 years. The previous one was a 74 240D - There is NO compairson between these two!

[lkchris]

Have them update the transmission software per recent DTBs. 02/08 or later version.

[Frugal1]

Okay . . . this is it. This is probably my last night as an "MB free" man. I am slated to commit to the 08 tomorrow evening.

My last concern is P1 vs P2. I've been driving with xenon's since 2002. There are separate threads covering opinions on the headlights and it is not my intention to start that debate here. However, my concern is with resale since this will probably be a 2 to 3 year ownership. On a trade-in, I probably won't get a penny of that P2 money back. On a private sale, the car would be far more desireable. My experience selling cars privately tells me it's very difficult to sell a high end car privately so I'm thinking I'll most likely trade this 08 in late in 2010.

I'm also a little concerned about value retention being adversely affected by the 2010, which I like. In 10 to 12 months the 2010 will be on the ground but I would wait until year end when the discounts get huge.


Any last thoughts?

Thanks!

[Alan Smithee]

I gotta say...if you're planning to trade it within two years and are at all concerned about resale, why are you buying new? Save $20k and either buy a used CDI with 2+ years left on the warranty or a CPO.

[Frugal1]

Originally Posted by Alan Smithee

I gotta say...if you're planning to trade it within two years and are at all concerned about resale, why are you buying new? Save $20k and either buy a used CDI with 2+ years left on the warranty or a CPO.

That's easy. Even though the changes were minor, I don't like the 05 or 06 CDI body style. And at the price I'll be paying, you cannot buy a used 07 for what I'll be paying for the new 08. I'm basically getting at least 1 year depreciation free. I try to always buy my cars this way. It's all in my name here!

Of course, I might like it so much that I won't be interested in the 2010 and it's adblue system and run-flat tires. It's probably 50/50 chance keep/trade with me in this case. I had my 2003 TL for 5 years, 5 months and I never planned for that.

[Frugal1]

Well, I finally did it. After hanging around here for YEARS, I jumped off the fence and bought an 08 E320 Bluetec.

Thanks to all who helped me in this decision in this thread and others!

Okay, is there some sort of initiation ritual?

[lkchris]

Keeping that transmission updated will be enough!