e300d lack of performance

[enewbie]

anybody have any suggestions on the basics of improving hp in the non turbo model?

[Gamesterx]

PUT TURBO ON IT! seriously why not turbo-charge it? Anyway, You can try adjusting the valves' http://www.dieselgiant.com/valveadjustment.htm ' also replace fuel filters "1 inline,1 large screw-in oil filter type,1 strainer in tank"

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by Gamesterx

PUT TURBO ON IT! seriously why not turbo-charge it? Anyway, You can try adjusting the valves' http://www.dieselgiant.com/valveadjustment.htm ' also replace fuel filters "1 inline,1 large screw-in oil filter type,1 strainer in tank"

Sorry, none of this applies to this model. All engines beginning with the 60x series in the mid-80s have hydraulic self-adjusting lifters, so forget that. Also, adding a turbo to that engine will not help, it was not designed to accomodate one and the computers have no way of controlling it.

Good service and premium diesel fuel is about all you can do besides selling it and buying something with more power.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

Sorry, none of this applies to this model. All engines beginning with the 60x series in the mid-80s have hydraulic self-adjusting lifters, so forget that. Also, adding a turbo to that engine will not help, it was not designed to accomodate one and the computers have no way of controlling it.

Good service and premium diesel fuel is about all you can do besides selling it and buying something with more power.

Why is it uncommon to see the usual hot rodding ways for gasoline engines used in diesel engines? I am referring to boring out the cylinders, putting in larger pistons, stroking and porting the engine. What about optimizing the air intake and free flowing headers? Are these useful?

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

Why is it uncommon to see the usual hot rodding ways for gasoline engines used in diesel engines? I am referring to boring out the cylinders, putting in larger pistons, stroking and porting the engine. What about optimizing the air intake and free flowing headers? Are these useful?

First off, I would not say that "hot rodding" is not delineated along gasoline and diesel lines nearly as much as it is good cars vs. inferior cars. The fact is that MB, BMW, etc, are less frequently and less extensively modded when compared to cheaper, less engineered cars. The fact is that with MB, the intakes and exhausts are usually far better than any aftermarket alternative, and especially in this case, any modification to either would yield worse performance. Since MB and other better manufacturers are able to extract so much power and efficiency from their engines, the returns for any modifications are far less and often come at the price of reliability, something that few, myself included, are unwilling to sacrifice.

[240D 3.0T]

Originally Posted by harkgar

I am referring to boring out the cylinders, putting in larger pistons, stroking and porting the engine.

If you have a hundred grand (or two) itching a hole in your pocket you can always design, fabricate and test some yourself. Otherwise, none of that stuff exists.

Diesels need more air than they can naturally flow to make power. That means a turbo, supercharger or nitrous.

[TMAllison]

If its a complaint of less power than it used to have, you might try having the inj's pop tested and re-balanced.

Pump timing and chain stretch doesnt seem to be much of an issue on the 606.9xx engines but I suppose both could be checked on the off chance they are out of spec.

Check to be certain the resonnance flaps are operating freely and clean out any gunk inside the IM and Crossover pipe.

Beyond that step on the go pedal more.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by 240D 3.0T

If you have a hundred grand (or two) itching a hole in your pocket you can always design, fabricate and test some yourself. Otherwise, none of that stuff exists.

Diesels need more air than they can naturally flow to make power. That means a turbo, supercharger or nitrous.

Why should petrol engines be different from diesel ones? Hot rodding magazines often promote cheap horsepower per dollar ways to soup up the engine. Often hundreds of dollars are needed only for things like free flowing intake and exhaust manifolds.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by 240D 3.0T

If you have a hundred grand (or two) itching a hole in your pocket you can always design, fabricate and test some yourself. Otherwise, none of that stuff exists.

Diesels need more air than they can naturally flow to make power. That means a turbo, supercharger or nitrous.

Another question240. I have yet to read about a supercharger for a diesel engine. Why?

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

Another question240. I have yet to read about a supercharger for a diesel engine. Why?

Since diesels have so much more airflow, it makes sense to harvest that energy for the forced induction rather than let it go to waste a use a supercharger that will not be able to provide as much power.

A supercharger is a relatively inferior concept to a turbocharger since it cannot deliver as much power. Superchargers take power and deliver more (drag on the engine), while turbos have a larger net gain. The problem is that with gasoline egines, especially lower displacement ones, you have lag issues, etc. Diesels have so much air that this is not as much a concern, and it is the optimal situation for a turbo.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

Why should petrol engines be different from diesel ones? Hot rodding magazines often promote cheap horsepower per dollar ways to soup up the engine. Often hundreds of dollars are needed only for things like free flowing intake and exhaust manifolds.

Like I said before, it is not a quesiton of diesel versus petrol, MB spends a lot of money to give you free-flowing intake and exhaust from the factory, instead of cheap cars where you have to add these yourself.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by TMAllison

If its a complaint of less power than it used to have, you might try having the inj's pop tested and re-balanced.

Pump timing and chain stretch doesnt seem to be much of an issue on the 606.9xx engines but I suppose both could be checked on the off chance they are out of spec.

Check to be certain the resonnance flaps are operating freely and clean out any gunk inside the IM and Crossover pipe.

Beyond that step on the go pedal more.

+1

Also, having the transmission serviced can increase performance, and you may as well change the differential fluid if it has not been done.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

+1

Also, having the transmission serviced can increase performance, and you may as well change the differential fluid if it has not been done.

Thanks all. I shall use my arthritic right foot and destroy the go pedal.

I hope I can contact you guys from jail.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

+1

Also, having the transmission serviced can increase performance, and you may as well change the differential fluid if it has not been done.

You are right. I did that with my sold W126 and felt the difference when hammering the right pedal.

[240D 3.0T]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

Superchargers take power and deliver more (drag on the engine), while turbos are only additive.

Not true. Turbos restrict the exhaust which costs power. The difference is the turbo is more efficient at compressing air on an engine.

[lkchris]

No, the difference is that turbos provide more even boost throughout the rpm range than do superchargers. That is, no gearing required.

In addition, with superchargers, all the energy in the exhaust flow is lost same as naturally aspirated engine. The energy required to drive a supercharger is significant while that used to drive the turbo is almost free.

Now that technology has been developed to allow turbo materials to survive the exhaust heat, the days of supercharging are numbered.

In 2008 the auto industry almost unanimously agrees that the path to improved fuel economy is smaller-displacement engines turbocharged.

Mercedes has officially announced this as its direction.

[240D 3.0T]

Originally Posted by lkchris

The energy required to drive a supercharger is significant while that used to drive the turbo is almost free.

Key word there. The restriction certainly restricts the engine, thats how exhaust brakes work.

Superchargers still have their place in applications that require instant boost off the line.

[lkchris]

Originally Posted by harkgar

Why should petrol engines be different from diesel ones? Hot rodding magazines often promote cheap horsepower per dollar ways to soup up the engine. Often hundreds of dollars are needed only for things like free flowing intake and exhaust manifolds.

This "iron" technology is mostly irrelevant as regards Mercedes.

There are zip/zero/nada intake or exhaust restrictions on Mercedes engines that can be "cured" by 'merikun hot rod techniques, always inexpensive. Even for the boat anchor iron these "solutions" are usually designed for, it's more hype than reality. That is, no "cure" required because there is no problem. "Real" solutions are only cheap in fantasyland.

Mercedes are small engines designed to scream on Autobahns. 'merikun iron is humongously big and not really designed to do much past 2500 rpm. Even the later--but definitely not the earlier--Mercedes diesels are designed as Autobahn stormers.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by lkchris

This "iron" technology is mostly irrelevant as regards Mercedes.

There are zip/zero/nada intake or exhaust restrictions on Mercedes engines that can be "cured" by 'merikun hot rod techniques, always inexpensive. Even for the boat anchor iron these "solutions" are usually designed for, it's more hype than reality. That is, no "cure" required because there is no problem. "Real" solutions are only cheap in fantasyland.

Mercedes are small engines designed to scream on Autobahns. 'merikun iron is humongously big and not really designed to do much past 2500 rpm. Even the later--but definitely not the earlier--Mercedes diesels are designed as Autobahn stormers.

I do not fully agree with you Ken. My sold 1999 E55 AMG had restrictive exhaust manifolds both cylinder banks. I suspect it is a packaging issue for a 90 degree V8 engine. The rest of the exhaust system is first class and free flowing. Even my friend's 2008 CL63 manifold is similar, that is, easily improved upon. That is why Kleemann and Carlsson make aftermarket systems for MB.

I agree that MB diesels are built with high speed autobahn cruising in mind and just as importantly economy.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by lkchris

This "iron" technology is mostly irrelevant as regards Mercedes.

There are zip/zero/nada intake or exhaust restrictions on Mercedes engines that can be "cured" by 'merikun hot rod techniques, always inexpensive. Even for the boat anchor iron these "solutions" are usually designed for, it's more hype than reality. That is, no "cure" required because there is no problem. "Real" solutions are only cheap in fantasyland.

Mercedes are small engines designed to scream on Autobahns. 'merikun iron is humongously big and not really designed to do much past 2500 rpm. Even the later--but definitely not the earlier--Mercedes diesels are designed as Autobahn stormers.

The 3 series straight 6, twin turbo diesel with 260 horsepower and over 400 pound foot? It is coming this November. It is so much more powerful than any MB diesel engine available now.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

The 3 series straight 6, twin turbo diesel with 260 horsepower and over 400 pound foot? It is coming this November. It is so much more powerful than any MB diesel engine available now.

This is simply the next generation of turbodiesel engines. MB is releasing th next generation very soon, starting with the new 2.2 litre 4 cyl developing 204 hp and 500nm torque (still more hp/liter than the BMW). The MB 6 cyl is coming soon, and will probably outdo the BMW as is the tradition between the two.

The BMW engine is still not the most powerful, the 420CDI has 320hp and a mountain of torque.

[240D 3.0T]

Next generation in cheapness. They are a step backwards in many things.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

This is simply the next generation of turbodiesel engines. MB is releasing th next generation very soon, starting with the new 2.2 litre 4 cyl developing 204 hp and 500nm torque (still more hp/liter than the BMW). The MB 6 cyl is coming soon, and will probably outdo the BMW as is the tradition between the two.

The BMW engine is still not the most powerful, the 420CDI has 320hp and a mountain of torque.

Does the new MB 4 cylinder need urea injection? It seems only larger engines need this device. Both VW and Honda (Acura) 4 cylinders do not need it.

The Acura is said to produce about 170 bhp. Good for a 2.2 liter four banger.

[harkgar]

Originally Posted by Untertürkheim

This is simply the next generation of turbodiesel engines. MB is releasing th next generation very soon, starting with the new 2.2 litre 4 cyl developing 204 hp and 500nm torque (still more hp/liter than the BMW). The MB 6 cyl is coming soon, and will probably outdo the BMW as is the tradition between the two.

The BMW engine is still not the most powerful, the 420CDI has 320hp and a mountain of torque.

there is one fault with this engine. It has a 62 degree (under 90 degrees anyway) V which means it is not as refined as a right angle formation.

In terms of power it is probably the best diesel engine. MB has killed it though.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

Does the new MB 4 cylinder need urea injection? It seems only larger engines need this device. Both VW and Honda (Acura) 4 cylinders do not need it.

The Acura is said to produce about 170 bhp. Good for a 2.2 liter four banger.

The Acura engine is not very impressive, that is the same output as the current MB 2.2 4-cyl, which will soon be replaced.

[Untertürkheim]

Originally Posted by harkgar

there is one fault with this engine. It has a 62 degree (under 90 degrees anyway) V which means it is not as refined as a right angle formation.

In terms of power it is probably the best diesel engine. MB has killed it though.

I found the S420CDI to be the most refined of any S class. It is the most quiet while driving, and I cannot think of a single fault of the car. I would say MB compensated for any possible lack in refinement with the 62 degree V.

[Mr.Billyd]

Hello,
Back to the original post, I have a 97 E300D 606 Eng. That is a bit of a Dog as well. I am about to reset the adaptive Trany. I am currently researching a ODB II scanner. I have the [MB Vehicle Communication] "Snap On"Manual. They use their MT2500 Scanner. I want to know what scanners out there will give you full access to all of this data in the 190 page manual? Before resetting my Tranny to Default, the manual says I can gain valuable information by looking at the values my tranny adapted to. Further to my Dog issue, my Resonance Flaps are Sh_t. Flipping around like a spastic. On Chapter 5 Engine Parameters, page 126 > a scanner that has proper access will give me some incite to these Resonance flapper. The lovely Surging (96-97) at 55-60mph. There are two sort of transducers that control these flappers, and without such a scanner you have to shot gun them.$$.
On the other hand the MT2500 cost some$$$. Anyone have a cheaper idea for a full access scanner? The MT2500 will record real time data in a log, ect.
Anyone with these motors replace the injectors? IF so, how long do they last

Thanks,
Bill

[TMAllison]

Originally Posted by Mr.Billyd

Hello,
Back to the original post, I have a 97 E300D 606 Eng. That is a bit of a Dog as well. I am about to reset the adaptive Trany. I am currently researching a ODB II scanner. I have the [MB Vehicle Communication] "Snap On"Manual. They use their MT2500 Scanner. I want to know what scanners out there will give you full access to all of this data in the 190 page manual? Before resetting my Tranny to Default, the manual says I can gain valuable information by looking at the values my tranny adapted to. Further to my Dog issue, my Resonance Flaps are Sh_t. Flipping around like a spastic. On Chapter 5 Engine Parameters, page 126 > a scanner that has proper access will give me some incite to these Resonance flapper. The lovely Surging (96-97) at 55-60mph. There are two sort of transducers that control these flappers, and without such a scanner you have to shot gun them.$$.
On the other hand the MT2500 cost some$$$. Anyone have a cheaper idea for a full access scanner? The MT2500 will record real time data in a log, ect.
Anyone with these motors replace the injectors? IF so, how long do they last

Thanks,
Bill

Try swapping transducers (I think you've got two?). My turbo has one controlling the EGR and another controlling the wastegate. They're identical. The turbo doesnt have resonnance flaps; I suspect you've got one controlling it.

The cheapest full service scanners are those that are software that resides on your home laptop.